The Redskins and Free Agency from 2010 – 2017
January 31, 2018
by Steve Thomas
A few weeks ago, I did a study of the success of the Redskins drafts over the past several years, grouped by those attributed to Mike Shanahan, Scot McCloughan, and Bruce Allen, respectively (click here to read it again). Some of you agreed and and liked the last column, and some of you called me names. Either way, it was enough to motivate me to write part II – a study of the free agency success and failures of each Redskins leader.
First, as was the case in my draft study, I have assigned responsibility for each free agency class as follows:
- Mike Shanahan: 2010, 2011, 2012, 2013
- Bruce Allen: 2014, 2017
- Scot McCloughan: 2015, 2016
As was true with the draft column, the problem with this setup is that it may or may not be entirely fair and/or accurate to give each man credit for these free agency classes as I’ve set out. It’s likely that the evaluation of free agents by the Redskins is a collaborative effort involving the scouting department, the coaching staff, and the senior person (i.e., Shanahan, Allen, McCloughan). Despite that, the Redskins have definitively gone through the “Shanahan era” with Shanahan as the public face of football operations, the “McCloughan era”, with Scot billed as the principal “football expert”, and then two separate years of Allen flying solo as the clear authority, with 2018 right around the corner. Regarding 2017, Scot McCloughan was fired on March 9, 2017, which was the same day the 2017 league year started. While McCloughan’s scouting without a doubt had an impact on free agency decisions made subsequent to his departure, the fact is that Bruce Allen was the sole decision maker for 2017. I therefore think it’s fair to evaluate these free agency classes in this manner. You may like it, not like it, or think this entire exercise isn’t worthwhile for the reasons I cited above. Take it for what you will.
In terms of methodology, there’s no good way to objectively quantify the success of a free agency class, so all we can do is take a look at free agency signings and departures for each relevant year and make a subjective evaluation of each class.
Finally, in order to keep the scope somewhat in check (hint: this is a long one, even for me), this column will not address undrafted free agent signings. That subject might be worthy of a third iteration in this series, if enough of you tell me that you would like to see it.
Shanahan Era[1]
2010
This is a list of the Redskins free agency moves for the 2010 offseason, which was Mike Shanahan’s first year in Washington:
Veteran Additions | Veteran Losses | |||
Position | Name | Position | Name | |
QB | Donovan McNabb | QB | Jason Campbell | |
QB | Rex Grossman | QB | Todd Collins | |
RB | Larry Johnson | RB | Quinton Ganther | |
RB | Willie Parker | RB | Rock Cartwright | |
WR | Mike Furrey | WR | Antwan Randle El | |
OT | Jammal Brown | OT | Chris Samuels | |
OT | Artis Hicks | G | Randy Thomas | |
DE/DT | Adam Carriker | NT | Anthony Montgomery | |
NT | Ma’ake Kemoeatu | CB | Fred Smoot | |
NT | Howard Green | P | Hunter Smith | |
CB | Phillip Buchanon | |||
P | Josh Bidwell |
- Home runs: none
- Clear Busts: McNabb
Looking at the list of additions, none of the players signed in 2010 became long-term starters for the Redskins or received any sort of league recognition during their time in Washington. Donovan McNabb must be considered the biggest and most obvious failure after infamously lasting only one controversy-filled season in DC. Despite signing a 6 year, $89M contract in November, 2010, he was traded to Minnesota before the 2011 season.
We can easily identify the other clear, but minor, misses: Larry Johnson, Willie Parker, Mike Furrey, and Howard Green did not make the team.
The remainder of the acquisitions had varying degrees of success. Of these players, Adam Carriker and Jammal Brown were probably the most successful acquisitions, but also saw their careers cut short at the beginning of new long contracts. Carriker started 31 games during the 2010 and 2011 seasons; however, he played just 2 games in 2012 after signing a 4 year, $20M contract with $5.7M in guarantees, before injuries effectively ended his career. Brown was acquired via trade in 2010, and then signed a 5 year, $27.5M contract with a $5.5M signing bonus. He started 26 of 32 games in 2 seasons before injuries finally caught up with him in 2012. Both of these players could have been critical players for the team going forward had they stayed healthy, although one could argue that the Redskins should have been aware of the injury potential for both men prior to giving them new contracts.
Rex Grossman, who played on 1 year contracts in DC, started 16 games between 2010 – 2012 before departing for Cleveland in 2014. Phillip Buchanon played in 16 games, starting 5, in 2010, but was suspended for 4 games for violation of the NFL’s performance enhancing drug policy, and then spent almost all of 2011 on injured reserve. Ma’ake Kemoeatu played one season and was released.
The bottom line is that none of the players acquired in 2010 became critical pieces for the future. Similarly, none of the players who left the team had successful, long follow-on careers with new teams, and were thus not missed opportunities by the team. Overall, this free agency year was not a rousing success.
2011
The Mike Shanahan-led Redskins made the following moves in the 2011 offseason:
Veteran Additions | Veteran Losses | |||
Position | Name | Position | Name | |
RB | Tim Hightower | QB | Donovan McNabb | |
WR | Jabar Gaffney | RB | Clinton Portis | |
OT | Sean Locklear | OT | Stephon Heyer | |
G/C | Chris Chester | G | Derrick Dockery | |
DE/DT | Stephen Bowen | G | Mike Williams | |
NT | Barry Cofield | C | Casey Rabach | |
CB | Josh Wilson | DE | Jeremy Jarmon | |
FS | O.J. Atogwe | DT | Albert Haynesworth | |
P | Sav Rocca | DE/DT | Vonnie Holliday | |
DE/DT | Phillip Daniels | |||
NT | Ma’ake Kemoeatu | |||
DE/OLB | Andre Carter | |||
CB | Carlos Rogers | |||
P | Josh Bidwell |
- Home runs: none
- Clear Busts: Atogwe
Chris Chester and Stephen Bowen, and to a lesser extent Barry Cofield, were fairly successful free agency acquisitions, despite the fact that none of these players actually completed their contracts with the team. Chester (5 year contract signed in 2011, $20M, $4M signing bonus) started all 64 games in the 2011 through 2014 seasons before his release before the final year of his contract. Bowen signed a 5 year, $27.5M contract in 2011 that included a $7.5M signing bonus, and started 42 of 64 games between 2011 and 2014. Like Chester, he was released prior to the final year of his contract after an injury-plagued 2014. Washington gave Cofield a 6 year, $36M contract in 2011, including a $9M signing bonus. He started 51 games between 2011 and 2014, including all 48 games between 2011 and 2013. He was released in February, 2015, after also suffering significant injuries in the 2014 season. That having been said, all three of these players were given very large contracts, and thus merely met those expectations, barely. None of these players ever achieved any sort of recognition while with the Redskins.
The one huge misfire in this class was O.J. Atogwe, who signed a 5 year, $26M contract in 2011 but started just 8 games and was released one year later. The remainder of the 2011 class were mediocre signings, with no other huge busts, but no additional long-term success stories. Tim Hightower, who signed two one year contracts with the Redskins, showed potential early in the 2011 before tearing his ACL and missing the rest of the season. He was cut in the 2012 preseason after the emergence of Alfred Morris. Jabar Gaffney started in 2011 but was released prior to the 2012 season.
Of all of players who left the Redskins in 2011, CB Carlos Rogers had the most subsequent success, playing 3 more seasons with the 49ers and a final year in Oakland. Andre Carter also played two additional years. I cannot honestly fault the Redskins for letting either player go, even despite Rogers’ relative success in San Francisco. None of the other departing players had significant post-Redskins success.
Overall, the 2011 free agency class was significantly more productive for the Redskins than the 2010 class, but the Redskins also paid a significant amount of money to these players.
2012
The Redskins 2012 free agency period went like this:
Veteran Additions | Veteran Losses | |||
Position | Name | Position | Name | |
WR | Pierre Garcon | WR | Jabar Gaffney | |
WR | Josh Morgan | WR | Donte Stallworth | |
ILB | Jonathan Goff | DE/DT | Kedric Golston | |
CB | Cedric Griffin | OLB | Rocky McIntosh | |
S | Tanard Jackson | SS | LaRon Landry | |
S | Brandon Meriweather | FS | O.J. Atogwe | |
K | Neil Rackers |
- Home runs: Garcon
- Clear Busts: Jackson
Pierre Garcon proved to be one of the best free agent signings by the Redskins in years despite his 5 year, $42M contract. Garcon started 72 games over his 5 years with the team, performing like a classic “#1 WR” during that time, including a 113 catch season in 2013. The Redskins chose to let him leave for San Francisco after the 2016 season, but the issue appeared to be related to salary demands, not performance.
I consider Tanard Jackson to be a major bust despite only signing a modest 1 year contract. Jackson, who had been a quality player when he was on the field and came to Washington with big expectations, immediately ran afoul of the NFL’s drug policy and never played a game for the Redskins. Jonathan Goff and Neil Rackers did not make the team and were misses.
The rest of these players – Morgan, Griffin, Meriweather – completed their contracts in relatively mediocrity. Of those, only Meriweather was re-signed.
Of the 6 veterans who were released, none of them had any significant post-Washington on the field accomplishments, and thus cannot be considered to be “mistaken releases” by the Redskins.
2013
In the final year of the Mike Shanahan era, the Redskins made the following free agency moves:
Veteran Additions | Veteran Losses | |||
Position | Name | Position | Name | |
WR | Devery Henderson | OT | Jammal Brown | |
WR | Donte Stallworth | DE/OLB | Lorenzo Alexander | |
OT | Jeremy Trueblood | CB | Cedric Griffin | |
DE | Darryl Tapp | CB | D.J. Johnson | |
CB | E.J. Biggers | S | Madieu Williams |
- Home runs: none
- Clear busts: none
- Mistaken release: Alexander
Of the five free agents signed in 2013, only E.J. Biggers (1 yr, $1.5M contract) could be considered even a modest success. Biggers played in all 16 games in 2013, starting 5, and was rewarded with a new 1 year deal in 2014. Tapp signed a 1 year, $865K contract and played 11 games for the Redskins in 2013, but was not re-signed. Henderson, Trueblood, and Stallworth were all given small contracts, but none made the team.
The most notable occurrence in 2013 was the Redskins’ failure to re-sign Lorenzo Alexander, a Pro Bowler in 2012, instead choosing to let him leave for Arizona for a 3 year, $4.62M contract. Alexander was released by the Cardinals in 2015, but has played in the NFL ever since leaving Washington and made the 2017 Pro Bowl again for Buffalo. Jammal Brown retired, and neither Griffin, Johnson, nor Williams had significant post-Washington NFL accomplishments.
Bruce Allen Era
2014
This is the list of the veterans the Redskins signed and released in the 2014 offseason:
Veteran Additions | Veteran Losses | |||
Position | Name | Position | Name | |
QB | Colt McCoy | WR | Josh Morgan | |
WR | Desean Jackson | TE | Richard Quinn | |
WR | Andre Roberts | C/G | Will Montgomery | |
OT | Bruce Campbell | DE/DT | Adam Carriker | |
G | Shawn Lauvao | DE/OLB | Darryl Tapp | |
G | Mike McGlynn | ILB | London Fletcher | |
DE/DT | Jason Hatcher | CB | Josh Wilson | |
DE/DT | Clifton Geathers | P | Sav Rocca | |
ILB | Daryl Sharpton | |||
ILB | Akeem Jordan | |||
CB | Tracy Porter | |||
S | Ryan Clark | |||
S | Brandon Meriweather |
- Home runs: Jackson
- Clear busts: Roberts, Hatcher
2014 was an extremely active free agency year. The star of this class was Desean Jackson, who essentially fell into the Redskins’ laps and signed a 4 year, $24M contract that automatically voided in the 4th year, thus essentially becoming a 3 year deal. While in Washington, Jackson played in 40 of 48 games over three years, starting 37. Despite some health problems, when on the field Jackson was one of the premier deep threats in the game, with 142 receptions, 19.0 average yards per reception, and 14 touchdowns. Jackson departed for Tampa Bay in free agency due to salary demands, but was everything the Redskins hoped for when healthy.
Colt McCoy (1 year, $795K) and Shawn Lauvao (4 years, $17M) were both quality signings who filled their required roles. Lauvoa, in particular, despite being criticized at times for his play, played in and started 41 of 64 games over 4 years. He has proved worthy of his 4 year deal.
Andre Roberts was signed to a 4 year, $16M contract, but was cut after only 2 years after producing only 47 catches in 25 games played and generally did not live up to expectations and is thus a “bust”. Jason Hatcher came to Washington with huge expectations after notching 11 sacks for Dallas in 2013. He signed a 4 year, $27.5M contract and started 27 of 32 games, but only posted 7.5 sacks in two years before his year after the 2016 season. Hatcher was supposed to be a bedrock of the defensive line, and while he was a starter and decent performer, he failed to live up to his contract or expectations. For that reason, I classified him as a bust.
The minor misses: Bruce Campbell signed a small contract but failed his physical a day later. Mike McGlynn signed a 2 year, $2.7M contract, but did not make the team. Daryl Sharpton also signed for a small contract, but was placed on injured reserve during preseason and never played a regular season game for the Redskins. Akeem Jordan signed a 3 year, $1.118M contract, but played in only 2 games and was waived in November, 2014. Finally, Ryan Clark and Brandon Meriweather were both older veterans with good reputations, but both signed small money one year deals, started for the Redskins, but were not re-signed. 2014 was Meriweather’s last of 3 seasons with the Redskins. For that reason, I do not consider Clark or Meriweather to be successes or busts.
Finally, none of the players who the team let go in the 2014 offseason had significant post-Redskins accomplishments in the NFL, and thus did not represent mistaken releases by the team.
2017
The Redskins accomplished the following in the 2017 free agency period under Bruce Allen:
Veteran Additions | Veteran Losses | |||
Position | Name | Position | Name | |
WR | Terrelle Pryor | WR | Pierre Garcon | |
WR | Brian Quick | WR | Desean Jackson | |
DT | Terrell McClain | C | Kory Lichtensteiger | |
DT | Stacy McGee | C | John Sullivan | |
OLB | Chris Carter | DT | Chris Baker | |
ILB | Zach Brown | DT | Ricky Jean-Francois | |
S | D.J. Swearinger |
- Home runs: Brown, Swearinger
- Clear busts: Pryor
Analysis of this most recent free agency class is incomplete, but fairly simple in some ways. D.J. Swearinger (3 years, $13.5M, $6M guaranteed at signing) thusfar appears to be one of the best, if not the best, free agency signing by the Redskins of this entire 2010 – 2017 period. He was outstanding all year, becoming a team captain and defensive leader in just his first season with the team. Zach Brown was also a home run given his relatively small cost and one year deal ($2.3M). Brown delivered in terms of production, with 84 tackles in 13 games.
Terrelle Pryor? Bust, due to the enormous expectations with which he came to Washington, despite him only being on a one year contract (although I personally think he still has potential). He didn’t produce and then was placed on injured reserve.
Chris Carter was a relatively low cost acquisition and performed his role fairly well.
I will reserve judgment on both Terrell McClain and Stacy McGee, who were both given large contracts (4 years, $21M and 5 years, $25M, respectively). Neither player excelled, particularly, but both were at least adequate in their first year here and have several years remaining on their contracts to prove their worth.
The Redskins let several prominent free agents leave this past season, including star wide receivers Pierre Garcon and Desean Jackson and defensive tackle Chris Baker. Garcon and Jackson, in particular, had tough years in 2017, but only time will tell if the Redskins made a mistake with any of those three players.
Scot McCloughan Era
2015
This was the Redskins 2015 free agency period:
Veteran Additions | Veteran Losses | |||
Position | Name | Position | Name | |
DE/DT | Stephen Paea | RB | Roy Helu | |
DE/DT | Ricky Jean-Francois | WR | Leonard Hankerson | |
NT | Terrance Knighton | OT | Tyler Polumbus | |
CB | Chris Culliver | G | Chris Chester | |
S | Dashon Goldson | DE/DT | Jarvis Jenkins | |
S | Jeron Johnson | DE/DT | Stephen Bowen | |
NT | Barry Cofield | |||
DE/OLB | Brian Orakpo | |||
CB | E.J. Biggers | |||
S | Brandon Meriweather | |||
S | Ryan Clark |
- Home runs: None
- Clear busts: Paea, Culliver, Goldson
- Mistaken releases: Orakpo
This particular free agency class was probably the least successful of all of the years evaluated in this study. None of these players were “home run” signings, and with the exception of Jean-Francois and Goldson, even provided much value.
Stephen Paea signed a 4 year, $21M contract that included a $5M signing bonus, but only played 11 games, starting 1, and produced just 11 tackles and 1.5 sacks before he was cut. Chris Culliver (4 years, $32M) arrived from San Francisco with a certain amount of fanfare as a supposed McCloughan favorite, but played only 6 games after being suspended for violation of the NFL’s personal conduct policy, and then tore his ACL and MCL. He was cut prior to the 2016 season. Dashon Goldson was traded to Washington prior to year 3 of a 5 year, $41.25M contract given to him by Tampa Bay. Despite some thought that Goldson might be the long-awaited post-Sean Taylor answer at free safety, he was cut after just one season.
Terrence Knighton signed a small one year contract, had minimal production, and was not re-signed. Ricky Jean-Francois signed a 3 year, $9M contract but was cut after year two.
In my view, the Redskins made a mistake in letting Brian Orakpo leave Washington for the Titans. Orakpo has started all 48 games in three seasons in Tennessee, and has 34.5 sacks and 106 tackles. This is a tough call because Orakpo is currently playing under a 4 year, $31M contract, which would be a significant salary cap burden.
2016
The chart below shows the Redskins 2016 free agency signings and veteran releases:
Veteran Additions | Veteran Losses | |||
Position | Name | Position | Name | |
TE | Vernon Davis | QB | Robert Griffin | |
DE/DT | Kendall Reyes | RB | Alfred Morris | |
CB | Josh Norman | DE/DT | Jason Hatcher | |
CB | Greg Toler | ILB | Keenan Robinson | |
S | David Bruton | CB | Chris Culliver | |
S | Dashon Goldson | |||
S | Trenton Robinson |
- Home runs: Davis, Norman
- Clear busts: Bruton
- Mistaken release: Morris
It should go without saying that Vernon Davis was and continues to be a godsend for Washington. He played the 2016 season on a 1 year, $2.4M contract, but was subsequently rewarded with a 3 year, $15M deal this past offseason. Davis has produced 87 catches and 5 touchdowns in his two seasons in Washington, and has generally been an outstanding addition to the team. Josh Norman came to Washington with great fanfare and a large 5 year, $75M contract. Norman has generally lived up to his billing as a #1 corner, with the exception of a portion of 2017, so at this point, I have labeled him as a “home run”. That status could be subject to change depending on what happens this coming year.
David Bruton signed a 3 year, $9.15M contract but was cut after only one year, and was thus a “clear bust” by my subjective definition.
Greg Toler played under a small one year contract and was not re-signed. Kendall Reyes signed a 1 year, $2.5M contract but was released prior to the season.
Of the players lost in free agency, only Alfred Morris and Keenan Robinson had significant post-Redskins accomplishes, so far. Morris, despite his steady decline after his 2012 season, has still been more consistent and produced more in Dallas than those who the Redskins brought in to replace him, so this was a mistake. While Robinson may the potential to go on to significant post-Redskins accomplishments it is too early to determine whether the Redskins erred in letting him leave.
Conclusion
What can we conclude from this study? Truthfully, the most important conclusion is that the Redskins have been consistently unsuccessful in free agency regardless of who has been in charge. Mike Shanahan only found 1 big success in free agency in Pierre Garcon, but spectacularly flamed out on Donovan McNabb and O.J. Atogwe and let Lorenzo Alexander leave. Scot McCloughan probably had the worst free agency year of any year in 2015 and missed on letting Alfred Morris leave, but signed both Vernon Davis and Josh Norman in 2016. Bruce Allen achieved similarly mediocre results (assuming you are like me and are going to assign the credit/blame for 2017 to him). The bottom line is that, objectively, despite his reputation and standing amongst the fanbase, Scot McCloughan did not achieve results that were noticeably better than either Mike Shanahan or Bruce Allen. It appears as though none of these men were particularly successful in free agency, which shouldn’t be a surprise given the overall performance of the team.
Do you have thoughts? Leave us a comment below.
[1] All free agency signings and losses in this column are courtesy of www.walterfootball.com unless otherwise noted. All statistical performance data courtesy of www.pro-football-reference.com. All contract data courtesy of www.spotrac.com or The Hog Sty’s salary cap chart at www.thehogsty.com.
The Insider should change their name to the Redskins Doom & Gloom Blog
You guys really need to update the links on your landing page
So, have we swapped Cousins yet?
i had a weird dream that the redskins got alex smith to be their qb. crazy, right?!?!
You are NOT a fan! Go follow the Chiefs if you give a damn about Fuller!
Good morning Redskins, time to start working on getting that pick back.
much more of a downer for me is the loss of fuller. but, hey, we have a qb.
http://www.thehogsty.com/2018/02/01/welcome-mr-smith/
It’s show time.
One can use half the video below as a Tyreek Hill highlight too. Dayum, he can scoot.
Something this offense is also lacking.
This is fun to watch:
https://twitter.com/NFL/status/958913446560505856
At 3:25 you can see Nicholson fuck himself up…. again.
T. Hill was wide the bleep open nearly every play. Shoulda gotten him in the trade, too.
Alex Smith’s pocket awareness is great. And the way he throws the ball deep to the sideline against cover 3 gives the middle deep safety no chance to get over the top of the play.
Helps to have a speedy WR though.
Not to nitpick the article above but I think Jamaal Brown was a trade not a FA. * I’m only here for the comments anyway.
The articles here are pretty on point. Way more information than that last place.
I respectfully disagree on content from the post vs here but this is a cool comment section and it’s really cool that the whole crew moved over here. Kudos to the Hog Sty.
Content over there was trash
The content was complete trash over there nothing but hater opinions and no football knowledge at all.
Yeah the Wapos articles were always 100% correct, wait I can’t stop laughing long enough to finish what I was saying.
Night peeps, what a trip the past 24 hours has been.
Yea it has
No doubt- the direction has been reframed.
Thank God for that. Let Kirk empty someone else’s pockets. I like the guy… but damn.
Whirlwind
Jonathan Tasini took to Twitter on Wednesday to declare that “God is working hard today to clean up the stink” because a “train full of Goopers” slammed into a dump truck
Sad
Which leads to the obvious question- Who the F is Jonathan Tasini? And why hasn’t he been hit by a dump truck?
I feel bad for the Driver’s family. It’s gonna be interesting how this plays out. It’s CSX’s rail but that section is leased out to another company, per local news. I’m within 45 minutes of the site.
Some CNN asshat
Am I crazy or is a 4.5 pt spread the best bet ever? I stopped betting on sports over a decade ago but I may need to lay some real money on NE. Foles v. Brady?
DJ SwearingerVerified account @JungleBoi_Swagg · 2h2 hours ago
More
No Disrespect to anyone Earlier Speaking Out Of Passion… For A Brother! But We Moving Fwd! Im Thinking #Championship Thoughts Only!! It’s All HTTR! We Will Be A Top 5 Defense Regardless of Who We Going To War With! Period!! #HARDWORK Will Pay Off #HTTR
No “My Twitter was hacked?” At least you manned up DJ
Exactly. I didn’t mind his comments – and I mind them less now with that follow up.
Top 5? Better back it up
Better get some help…
Caps beat Philly 5-3, suck it trashcity
So I showed my wife the Alex Smith highlights reel. She’s moved on from Kirk, it’s official. One thing that tripped me out was that she pointed out that Smith hit his receivers in stride. She didn’t say it that way but with some explanation, it’s what she meant.
“Hit me in stride but don’t hit me in my hands”
-T Pryor
https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/d76e40db48f3a170c8e8418130bc5e4724b366c78c7e692e91eac4d66325fe60.png
The corn again… hehehe
The long way is the wrong way
The return
“I remember he dropped for injury but I didn’t know what his projection was…”
Moreau started out as a day one pick, listed as CB/FS, by late March he had dropped.
Fuller played mostly outside at Tech. He was always a day one pick until the knee injury.
Also, Moreau has posted a 4.3 40
Good to know… promising
Greg Stroman, CB, Virginia Tech
Secdrick Cooper, FS, Louisiana Tech
Either of these two guys late this year would be clay for Coach Gray’s kiln.
I really like Fuller but the coaching staff wouldn’t have signed off on this deal unless they love what Smith will bring to this Gruden offense and unless they felt that they have answers for losing Fuller- I think Moreau (Island?) is a big part of that.
I have been calling him The Island of Dr. Moreau
Hey bud, good to see you back.
QB being locked down trumps all, just the way it is. We don’t have a replacement for Fuller yet, just promise.
Yeah I agree. The QB noise being silent is worth a premium in my opinion. I am not being an apologist- I genuinely love the way Alex Smith plays football these days. I’m actually really excited. I think it was a hell of a rally to end up off the rollercoaster with him.
Prepare to be belittled, mocked and laughed at
Now that he’s gone I don’t miss Cousins. You look at Brees who says he’d never leave NO. Brady always taking roughly half of what he could get on the open market. I know it’s naive but it is that type of guy that I want around. Not someone that’s playing grab ass and saying he wants to be here but won’t take a phone call or even negotiate.
Granted- our FO has come across as a joke forever – but this is all ok to me.
That’s not naive, that’s wanting a Redskin to support, to raise your kids watching. Someday I hope we have a Brees.
Yessir.
Certain peeps will think you a fool. I’m “meh” on the whole thing. Not happy about losing Fuller but Kirk wasn’t coming back and now we can move on so…
Yeah, I don’t like the price, but what I want or like is a fart in a whirlwind as far as our management is concerned. I’ve been sour all day and it’s out now.
Fuller schmuller, fuck that guy.
Too soon
So I guess everyone has seen the Kim K pics by now? I know she’s trash but her plastic surgeon is a godamn artist
Um… nope
https://instagram.com/p/BejK5AaFvpV/
NSFW
https://twitter.com/jbendery/status/958525027854495745
Looks like she’s sitting on a thumbtack .
Looks like she’s shifting her dentures around.
That too. She was working that tongue around pretty good
Thinking of Hillary and gettin down
I just threw up in my mouth
She’s got some large meats for a 77 year old.
Take out those dentures and expose those meats and…the rest is in one’s imagination.
I’m feeling ill…
I think one of her daughters is a republican. Should make for interesting family get togethers.
https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/8c6087b8d11565aad9a2c6dda43ac1d813c711eec9f544ef40ae2244d3cbb2dc.jpg
So, when does or when can Cousins’ agent start talking to other teams?
Rumor is he already is
I thought it was something like the beginning of the new league year.
Technically.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GsNPVQA8Pkk
Damn you Hillbilly Jim!!!!!
I wonder what happened to HokieSkins ? Hadn’t seen him in a good while
I haven’t been back to TI. He’s not posting there either?
Hadn’t seen him but I haven’t looked really
Since November
He’ll turn up
Nobody saw anything out of Fuller in year one.
You can’t look at year one… you have to look at his junior year in college
LOL.
Thats what solid NFL scouts do. Rookie year back from injury 2nd year. And then “can we trade for him ? “
Sure… you know what “solid NFL scouts do.”
Now THAT’S funny
Chiefs did well. Philly same. Etc.
Giants will probably ascend as well.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=566XTUUgx_w
Bam-Bam Bigelow!!!!
He’s wrestling Pennywise??
That’s QGC
If memory serves, Fuller did not have ligament surgery. It was meniscus with a follow-up micro-fracture procedure. That micro-fracture is some dicey ish, happy for Fuller he recovered OK.
It was a meniscus injury…
QGC wrong again?
Hmmm… I’m sensing a trend.
Yes. I remember it being serious.
Hamas co-founder dies after accidentally shooting himself in face, militant group says
Looking down the wrong end of the barrel…“Is this thing loaded”
I swear it wasn’t me… I realize my recent absence coincides exactly with his demise and I was actually in that part of the world but that is all circumstantial…
Mission Accomplished.
gonna be tough for him to find any virgins that want a faceless freak.
Only virgins these days are 14 year old, fat, pimply faced boys
Oh yuck. You’re right. LOL
Re Fuller…he was coming off an ACL injury and was playing for a fired staff. Not sure why ppl would compare year1 w year 2. Better comp would be Jr in college w year 2. Both years highly regarded. Projected 1st rounder before ACL. Apples and apples.
Apples to apples is junior year in college to second year pro?
Ok…
Healthy and healthy.
Ok… damn dude. Get with it.
You really say some dumb shit
Factual more like it. Hang in there dude.
Yawn… you’re tedious and vapid.
Very tedious I admit.
Nope. College talent vs NFL talent, not apples to apples
Don’t bother… the guy has rocks in his head
Point is ..coming back from ACL injury aint easy as a rookie in NFL. Not complicated . For the trivials perhaps…
Apples to apples was in reference to his last 2 healthy seasons. Anyway..
As a general rule, I never get really high or low on rookies.
Look with a cold eye AFTER two full camps and 32 games.
Gotcha. Im kinda the opposite.
Now that’s a stretch
Slot corners in draft
Duke Dawson, Blace Brown, Chandon Sullivan, Jalen Davis
I’ll go ahead and say it. I haven’t seen anything out of Moreau to make me think he’s going to play at Fuller’s level.
played very few defensive snaps, made ST tackles though
Yes.
He was a rook, missed a good portion of the off-season. Looks more like an outside corner to me though.
Yep.
I mean, Fuller year one was nothing like Fuller year two. Tough transition.
Sure. So, inasmuch as neither of them were remarkable in year one, then yes. But I would say that most players who are unremarkable in year one don’t suddenly become one of the best at what they do in year 2.
Did he actually play a lot of corner with Fuller, Breeland, and Norman manning the start and Dunbar playing most of the backup?
Moreau didn’t play much corner.
No doubt. But I wouldn’t judge any player until after their 2nd year at the earliest, after their 3rd is even better. RG and Fuller are Redskin examples.
Didn’t see anything out of Fuller in year one to think he would play at year 2’s level.
True dat
Agreed… but what you saw in year 2 was considerably better than you would have expected based on year 1. The only way people can say “we already have his replacement on the roster” is if there is now some expectation that Moreau will ALSO blossom into a top-tier slot corner, and there isn’t any reason to think he will, that I can see.
I’m not sure we have his replacement on staff already. Fuller was very good in college. He would have been drafted higher if not for a blown out knee. I don’t think Moreau was that highly touted.
IIRC, Moreau was expected to be a first round guy until an injury as well, so I supposed that’s something else they have in common.
Huh… did not know that
Yeah – just looked it up. He was a late 1st to early 2nd guy, but tore his pec doing bench reps on his pro day, and already had taken a broken foot in college, so the injury rep dropped his stock.
I remember he dropped for injury but I didn’t know what his projection was…
Will never be all pro. SMH
Don’t forget about Hosley
Who?
Seems to me that now that it appears Cousins is on his way out of here, media types are now touting him as the next Brady. While he was here he was just your average quarterback.
I think the jury is still out on Cousins. It remains to be seen what he could do with GOOD team. He did pretty well with a bad one.
Chances are he won’t go to a good team unless you count Denver or Jacksonville.
As a UFA, he can cherry pick.
Does Denver or Jax have the kind of money Cousins will demand?
He may not demand as much to go to a better team.
True
I wonder who will court him and where he will go. I think he’ll choose the team he thinks has the best chance of winning.
Who is that?
Jax has got to be the best team in the running for him, I’d think… unless New Orleans wants to shift things up.
Brees is 39…
And a UFA, no?
Yes
I must admit I’ve wondered what Alex Smith would have looked like on the field this past year with this team. 26 different starting offensive line combinations in 14 games, 7 different running backs, and a receiving corps that was anything but special. I think he would have led the team in rushing.
Does losing Kirk and signing Smith zero out and impact our chance at a comp draft pick? Smith technically wasn’t a FA but I’m unsure how that works.
Nope
No. Comp picks are based on UFA’s only. The comp system is kinda weird, round grades are assigned and you can ‘lose’ a comp pick by signing another round graded UFA.
Gracias
And not all UFA’s even receive a ’round grade’. As scamp noted, Kirk will definitely receive the highest 3rd round grade. Will Compton for instance likely won’t receive a grade. Brown and Breeland will depend on their new deals, playing time. But let’s not lose both those cats too.
So I’m back from a long trip overseas and return to this…
Oh man. Bummer. Kirk II
The SofU wasn’t so bad.
Missed it. I was mid flight trans-atlantic. Got home and crashed.
We missed it, too. We were too busy blogging about the trade
Laughing, priorities and all…
You’re not on a ledge are you?
Laughing… nope… I think Alex Smith is darn good QB… hate the deal though. Chiefs get a top corner and 3rd round pick for their QB… what did we get? Oh yeah… nothing.
But you like Smith? Doesn’t sound like it.
I like Smith a lot. I think we dorked up the whole Cousins deal though for 3 years. Then he walks and we get nothing. The Chiefs got a great deal. We got nothing for Cousins.
Ah. Gotcha.
I like Smith ok…just steep and seems like a long contract. Not sure if he is a SB QB after 13 years…seems like spinning retreaded wheels
Smith isn’t a star player but he’s dependable and makes good decisions with the ball. He is also good at escaping the pocket and making plays with his legs. The problem is unless we greatly improve our running game and receiving corps he won’t make any difference to the offense.
ALL IN FOR BARKLEY!!!
Pretty much. Gotta lose the choke calls when game in the balance too tho
We’ll get a 3rd round comp next year. We basically traded Fuller for Smith and one draft position.
Is that comp guaranteed?
^ No. Depends on who we sign vs. who we lose and the ‘value’ of those players.
No… but pretty close considering the money Kirk will make and the playing time he will get and the other FA’s we are sure to lose.
That 2016 draft is almost like it never happened. Ioannidis the Lone Ranger huh?
I still have high hopes for Doctson. He’s got the tools, so we’ll see.
True true
smokey • 2 hours ago
Next order if business: work on getting Brown on the payroll
________________________
This…
…but Swearinger is mad that Fuller was traded so we probably have no chance.
If you get alittle blubbery about it……. there’s a Creed song.
Then I’ll be suicidal
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S50IGVCG_4w
Mark Bullock @MarkBullockNFL · 2h2 hours ago
More
Mark Bullock Retweeted Benjamin Allbright
Those fades at the Senior Bowl must have caught Gruden’s eye
Mark Bullock added,
Benjamin AllbrightVerified account @AllbrightNFL
Washington fans may want to keep an eye on Kyle Lauletta in the draft.
Sure hope they wise up and grab someone legit. 2 30’s plus QBs an injury away from further depths.
Not a pretty picture right now…
…but it hasn’t been a pretty picture for a while now.
FA and the draft will be telling about this crew. If they dont draft a high potential QB ..then not sure of the confidence in the scouts. I mean if there was a year for a QB this looks like it
Lot of em in this draft.
Wonder what next years draft will look like…
Decent probably. But if a guy is there…we passed on Rothlesberger and Wilson. Hate to see a pass on a Mayfield or even Allen or White etc.. but…
More funnies….if they make the playoffs its a win trade. Lol. Playoffs. Not the SB…playoffs. LOL. I see it now. We went 9-7 ! FO and coaches deserve extensions ! Lol
People crack me up. Trying to find justifications… Got a 2nd round S wanting to quit and trade a 2nd rounder ( if not injured in college) starter. Hey…we got tbe draft tho. LOL
And FA….but didnt read the article. LOL
I don’t think the article is trying to justify anything . That’s not the intent .
Not refering to article. Ricks draft/FA and others comments…and my own view.
Mo is snubbing you Rick.
Faulkner, lol
mista moe
2:45 PM EST
At some point, some scribe will review the passing of history: from the decision to trade up to get RG3 to his flash in the pan success then massive fail on the eve of Cousins’ own emergence would indeed be a tale of sound and fury signifying nothing.
Friends…this is the NFL…you have to “give” to “get”. Alex Smith is a top 15 QB with some playoff pedigree. You don’t get top QB’s for nothing. Let’s see how this plays out. Holsey may be able to play the slot. We’ve got free agency…the draft.
Too late. I’ve already sharpened my pitchfork!
LOL
Lol. Drink that Bruce koolaid. Free agency and the draft…they using Scots board again?
Not as high on Smith as others but am glad the situation is settled. Let’s see how this plays out…
Like I said… Smith is simply an older, less expensive, less turnover prone Kirk. Nothing super special about the guy
Again I LOVED Fuller, but you’re not about to get me to say he’s irreplaceable.
He’s the equivalent of a mid-high first rounder. Replaceable? Sure, everyone is replaceable for a price.
He’s not irreplaceable. But he didn’t need replacing.
I’ve been an Alex Smith fan for years and am glad he’ll be our QB. I hate the fact we gave up someone who was one of the better guys in league at their position in order to get him.
Fuller was also on his rookie contract. So great value for the money.
Yup
Nobody is irreplaceable not named Brady or Rogers. But aren’t you the one who cries about draft and developing guys then letting them go? He’s the definition of drafted, very tough rookie campaign and balled his 2nd year. I don’t get it
I think the Redskins may have panicked a little. They knew Kirk wasn’t going to resign. And they really liked Smith…perhaps too much in that they gave him to the Chiefs in order to get the deal done.
Sometimes you just need to know when to walk away from a deal.
Yes…and sometimes you have to make that deal. We drafted, developed and kept Dunbar.
That’s me… I cry about that
Right.. Neither was Talib back when or Sherman or Butler etc
You’re comparing Fuller to Talib, Sherman and Butler?
Ok…
Uhh yes. Has the potential. Or do you disagree??? Your crystal ball clearer than mine if so. As did those guys have potential after year 1 and 2. Of course they have all pro S backup to help their game…and didnt come off ACL surgery.
Snarkiness noted. I don’t need a crystal ball… I don’t make foolish comparisons between guys with one good year and perennial pro bowlers.
Good for you. One good year is the beginning of perennial. Not sure why you call it foolish. Again your crystal ball seems clearer to use the word. I will revisit this back and forth in a year or 2
You don’t understand why I call it foolish to compare pro bowlers with Fuller?
Ok
He compares to a pro bowler. At least to some analysts. PFF bad him a 90 grade. Yes he will be a pro bowler imo. But be trivial dude. Whateva .
Im done here dude.
You wonder why people don’t like you… you come on here laughing at guys comments and opinions like Rick and what have you while he didn’t say word one to you… like you’re some fucking expert. You’re nothing but a condescending has been that don’t know shit. Fuck you clown.
Stop sugar coating it SCamp…
The guy is a fucking tool
“The slot is far from an inconsequential position in today’s NFL. Fuller was on the field for 719 snaps this past season — that’s more than any single Redskins down lineman,” Renner wrote in an article published online Wednesday by The Post. “Fuller’s departure is that much more significant for Washington, given the Redskins’ NFC East opponents all have excellent slot weapons. Washington faces the likes of Sterling Shepard, Odell Beckham Jr., Nelson Agholor and Cole Beasley, who all line up in the slot. Both Shepard and Agholor finished in the top five in total yards from the slot a season ago, while Beasley finished sixth in 2016
Ugh
Oh he’s easy to replace. our front office has everything under control I mean look at their Stellar record doesn’t that give you confidence?
Slot CB was a huge problem for years until we finally found a keeper [*cough*] in Fuller.
Who’s FO was it that found him in the first place.
Fuller will be missed but we already have an inhouse option to replace him and we can find a FA aswell or draft pick.
https://twitter.com/AllbrightNFL/status/958846914610515968
Your score is: 17784 (GRADE: B-)
Your Picks:
Round 1 Pick 17 (LAC): DaRon Payne, DT, Alabama (B+)
Round 2 Pick 12: Sony Michel, RB, Georgia (B+)
Round 2 Pick 16 (LAC): Will Hernandez, OG, Texas-El Paso (A-)
Round 4 Pick 13: Anthony Averett, CB, Alabama (A+)
Round 5 Pick 12: Poona Ford, DT, Texas (A)
Round 6 Pick 14: Cedrick Wilson, WR, Boise State (A+)
Round 7 Pick 13: Bryce Bobo, WR, Colorado (A+)
Round 7 Pick 23: Mike White, QB, Western Kentucky (C)
Nice, you got my boy Averett.
Yeah I think he is going to be solid.
I just like messin’ with Austin about his “short” arms
You’re an idiot.
Poona pass rushing the Quarterback highlights!
https://media.giphy.com/media/3oEduZmgAm2oJ0uOs0/giphy.gif
Ouch! My pectorals!
Like that draft a lot
I think if we trade down inside the top 20 we can still get Vea or Payne and recoup a 2nd or 3rd.
Yes, if we can it’s great
Good draft
Thanks
A+++++++++++++++++++++
– Austin
POONA! MVP of your mock. Hail yeah #HookEm
Unwrapping a new gift.
https://www.arrowheadpride.com/2018/1/31/16954286/kendall-fuller-film-review-how-could-the-redskins-trade-this-guy
Not gonna read it.
I had to watch the Creed video after…. fuckin’ bullshit.
*sigh* Well, sheeet. At least he’ll only be 25 when we bring him back in 2020.
Thanks for turning the knife… why???
To keep everyone grounded. Remember what the price is.
Reid ran all those creative looks with his RB and Hill . Some of those college type plays , taking advantage of Smith’s legs . Gruden is all about the pocket and reads and progressions . Somewhere they have to make those things come together . Gruden can get some guys open down the field . He is good at that . There was almost always somebody open even when they were missing so many key guys .
I’m am not at all interested in losing Fuller AND Brown AND Breeland in the same off-season.
Agreed
Don’t you worry our front office has everything under control.
-Flounder
Gruden can coach up a QB and an offense . If nothing else , he can do that . The two together will most likely move the ball up and down the field fairly consistently . Red zone and game management are the big question marks . Need that run game to increase the red zone into TD’s .
Welllllll…
-RG
Some therapy… puppies, hugs, hot chocolate.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=99j0zLuNhi8
I loved you Kirky !!!! You broke my heart .
flounder, what you don’t know about me is I couldn’t really care less who our quarterback is as long as he is copetent dent. And he has the tools surrounding him like a stellar defense and rushing attack. He’ll even you could be the quarterback and I’d be rooting for you as long as you are a winner. But this trade for an older version of Kirk Cousins with perhaps a little bit more Mobility and giving up a young secondary player whose damn good and a third round draft pick is just stupid but everyone that comes here and has been here for more that a minute, knows you are an organizational apologist. at least you own it and I applaud you for that
Next order if business: work on getting Brown on the payroll
I have been at my daughter’s soccer practice so I haven’t been keeping up with the blog. But I see flounder must have said something like cousins did it all by himself. Have you heard of hyperbole? Cousins had crap for defense and even work rushing attacks the whole time he’s been here.
Fishy was being sarcastic.
Yes we know our defense gave up 40 points a game and that’s why we lost it was never cousins fault, poor little baby.
It’s not like Cousins was awful in the redzone or anything.
You are like me . We’re gonna have to work on our separation anxieties and let KC go !
He will have to take down his Cousins poster first.
LOL .
I look at the team that I root for with eyes wide open
No you look at Cousins with eyes wide open obviously.
Fly?
On the bright side , I don’t see this as a McNabb type scenario like some are saying . McNabb was a douche and I don’t think that’s Alex Smith.
It’s not an awful trade. Not a great trade.
Rationalization
McNabb rolls outta the pocket, literally!
I agree. But hard to ignore the similarities. Andy Reid, 34yrs old, contact extension (except McNabb had zero guarantees)
Spectacular moon. Check it out before it gets any higher.
Flounder Lbsand • 27 minutes ago
Yeah Cousins had nobody ever since he got here he played by himself.
———————————–
Better by than with, for sure.
I’d like to find our Kareem Hunt or a guy with Hill’s speed . They are out there someplace .
Yep
maybe not Hill’s speed. there may NOT be
I bid you farewell Kirk
May you travel well with the wind at your back.
Welcome to our home Alex
May your arm not be too weenie and may you be light-footed with courage
FYI, they’ve apparently skipped the Caps show and are rolling live on Comcast channel 642.
Yeah funny how everything else takes a back seat around here.
Bout fuckin’ time!
Wizards beat the Thunder last night without John Wall but nobody knew because nobody talked about it today.
Lol
^ Heck of an effort.
Yeah finally.
Reed is not as good as Kelce, but when/if Reed is healthy, he’s gonna beast in the offense.
If Reed is healthy for 16 games he can be a top 3 TE in the NFL.
Bottom line , Smith can win . They just need to make good decisions with surrounding players . I keep wanting to play devils advocate with Cousins , but it serves no point . I liked the hell out of the guy , but it’s over . I might cry actually …
Yeah can;t wait for the off season to get started.
Yep , time to move on now . Glad they got it settled because it was a huge dark cloud hovering over everything .
My wife is demanding Alex Smith highlights, lol, wants to see if she’s mad or not.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UuO5RdjKGyg
Check out highlights starting at around 2:02 (Skins/Chiefs)…..also….I don’t see a lot of checkdowns in this film.
Led NFL in QB Rating.
Smith isn’t exactly gonna wow us with high risk/high reward, tight window throws. He checks down. A Lot. Jay wanted Kirk to take more chances, we’ll see if he can get Smith to.
Smith did that this year once Reid gave up play calling. I think Reid is more of get the ball out quickly instead of take shots down field.
And he had some of the best YAC players in the NFL: Kelce, Hunt, Hill. Those guys in space, smh. Got ’em the ball, and they made plays.
Yeah true but once he started going down field it opened up their offense.
Yup. Hill really makes safeties pucker up.
Sand, it’s going to air again at 8:00 pm est
Cool, thanks.
Yup
Joey T’s on board with it ! We good .
Boom.
They had an agent /consultant on the show who had knowledge and had represented some Redskin players in the past , discussing the Cousins /FO relationship and why it soured so bad .
Saw that
Sorry I missed that.
They’ll repeat it later, most likely. 642 Comcast
Thank you!
Never seen him before .
I missed the first part, got it set to record at 8
“Kirk holds the ball too long on deep routes” – Joey T
Did you hear that other guy ? I didn’t catch his name .
What you listening to Buck?
CSN . Chick and crew .
Thanks keep the updates coming.
They all agree Alex Smith is a great choice .
Redskins 100
Dan Snyder could run naked through the city peeing on tourists and Joe would support it.
‘Dan Snyder! Electrifying!!’
– Larry
I don’t think Denver’s a good spot for the long haul for Kirk.
Why? Curious on your take.
Cousins will not have the success anywhere else that’s needy for a QB as he had here.
Maybe Jacksonville
I dunno. Broncos could turn it around pretty quick, those cupboards ain’t bare. He could land in Minnesota or J-Ville too.
Even the Steelers could be in the hunt depending on Big Ben.
True, but they may be more concerned with signing Bell.
Crowder’s gonna “eat”.
Crowder peas ?
“I remember Joe Theismann getting all his front teeth knocked out against the Giants and he comes over to the side lines spittin’ blood and other stuff….he threw 3 interceptions that game, then led us down the field later to win the game”- Joe Gibbs
Kirk’s gonna sign a 5 yr contract at $20m a year $70M guaranteed. Fans will be livid lol. But in all serious peeps are waiting for his contact before they can internally move on. Then it’ll confirm if it was personal or not.
If he signs that it becaue that is the most that was offered.
Which is exactly the point…would be personal
No it would be because that was the best he could do.
Not necessarily. He’s said he’s more interested in signing with a competitive franchise than maximizing his dollars.
Has there already been a comparison done between Cousins and Smith?
Yes, they’re statistically almost the same. Smith doesn’t have a “process”. He plays football.
No they aren’t the same
Look at sack/fumbles.
Since 2015, Alex has been sacked 108 times, and fumbled 13 times
Since 2015, Kirk has been sacked 90 times, and fumbled 31 times
Think about that one…
Smith had Hunt, Kelce, Hill. Cousins did not. Kirk fumbles, Smith doesn’t. Both are legit, neither is elite.
Yeah Cousins had nobody ever since he got here he played by himself.
LOL.
Yeah he had no running game and never did . His TE’s were hurt and old as dirt . Pryor didn’t do shit . Doctson dropped way too many balls and the O Line had more injuries than I can remember . Thompson broke his leg , Trent Williams was hurt every week . Defense finished last vs the run , ST’s sucked .
They got the best guy available for their offense . The focus should be what do they do to help him. BMitch is going off by the way .
About Fuller?
Yes and the fact they don’t have a running game, the defense …..you name it.
CSN, I’m checking it out.
They discussed the toxic relationship that had developed between you know who and the FO
Gibbs went to the playoffs twice with ole ass, worn out armed Mark Brunell
Remember him at Jax, lol
He was real good in JAX….2 straight AFC Championships
I dated a girl back then who’s peeps were from Jax, she actually knew football so that was cool.
Did she have a big booty?
Yes. 5’10 or 11, small C cups fat ass. Long legs, blonde….. Florida girl. Touch of freckles
Why didn’t you marry her?
Cause she was wild, and so was I. One of those girls you think back about…
A good chance the Redskins make a play for Jarvis Landry
That would be fine.
Take Crowder off of returns.
Yes, please.
– Alec Smiff
It will be nice to see what this team can do with less injuries.
playoffs
Anything less and jobs are in serious jeopardy.
Smith had really done well under Reid; that team won a lot of games. Chiefs O has some crazy speed: Hill, Hunt, Kelce. Top tier talent right there.
There’s a part of me that thinks that bringing Alex Smith in signals that the Redskins are interested in taking a QB early in the draft to learn under the guy, Mahomes-style, because this dude is not the future.
Id be okay with that.
Here’s the thing…can you WIN with Alex Smith?
I don’t think you win with Alex Smith any more than you won with Kirk Cousins.
I agree with that.
Me too.
Depends on the team around him. Look what he had last year . We have almost none of that .
Yeah
Less turnovers means more chances to win. YES
Definitely. He’s won a pant-load of games.
Can Alex Smith run our offense better than Kirk? That’s what really matters.
Gotta love Smith’s 2018 contract, that’s for damn sure.
Question…
Do you give Terrell Pryor another shot on a one year deal…Clearly he and Kirk didn’t click.
Newp.
Garbage… no
Pass.
Yes. And trade him right away to Cleveland.
Negative
One thing to consider about Grandpa Alex is this, he’ll run on yo ass, you have to account for him. This opens up all sorts of stuff for guys like CT, even Perrine, or Lord willing, a running back like R Penny.
A dual threat QB is always hard to account for…one that will throw it on the run too.
Just like AlMo benefited from Griffin.
Stop trying to get peeps excited for Alex. They don’t want any part of it.
It’s the why he runs though. He’s way too quick to scamper out of the pocket when there’s still time to throw. And when he goes, he tends to go. There’s no looking downfield to find an open receiver.
Where do you come up with stunning analysis ? Smith did well last year especially with his deep ball.
I think Alex Smith will do about as good a job as Kirk has done. I’m not gonna get all excited about it, because I’ve learned not to get excited about the Redskins, especially when it comes to big-name quarterbacks.
“Look…everybody was there against the Giants so let’s not make anybody out to be the 85′ Bears. Let’s move on.”- Doc Walker
Nicholson, Allen, Brown, Foster and Ioniddis together and this defense is a whole lot better
So let’s see…
Fabian Moreau
Quentin Dunbar
Josh Norman
Josh Holsey
They’re doomed without Kendall Fuller.
I like this view:
Kelly Big Buck64 • 27 minutes ago
I said it. If I’m Bruce Allen, what I’m telling Jay is:
“I’m gonna keep getting you linemen until you show me you can run the ball and stop the run. Once you can do those things, I’ll go find you a QB.”
LOL
I’m not certain that would fly with a NFL head coach, but it’s good sense.
I think it’d fly with Gruden. It wouldn’t fly with a guy who has had some success and can throw his weight around a bit.
You have to try to win now . That’s not going to happen . Rolling with Colt says they are rebuilding again.
Well, when shit gets fucked up, sometimes that’s where you’re at.
sometimes ? Try again
All the time, most times, for the past two decades, whatever blows your dress up.
Rolling with a 34 year old says they think he’s the missing piece to the puzzle, cuz he sure ain’t the future.
The thing is – Kirk’s play hasn’t been what’s been holding the Skins back, so how is a QB the final piece?
“I like the fact that we’re no longer in limbo. I like that there’s a good situation for both guys. We didn’t win a whole helluva games with him, but it’s never one guy’s fault”- Doc Walker
Kikr had already said he wasn’t doing anything until the tag day, can’t wait that long move on.
Kirk can kiss my ass.
Imagine if we would have waited on him and then it fell apart and we were left with Colt or some other career backup castoff from another team.
I’d say the majority consensus is that,
1. We’re glad the Kirk drama is almost over
2. We hate it that it cost Kendall Fuller
Good summary. #1 didn’t really bother me at all, #2 bums me out.
Signing Kirk after 2015, was hindsight. There are PLENTY of people that thought the Redskins should have waited.
Scotty McGlue was a big reason for that
There were plenty of us who wanted him to get the gig in 2013 as well.
Yup, there were. There also were a bunch of folks that insisted he was a ‘career back up’.
the thing about Kirk that I always go back to, it isn’t through any fault of his own, but when we blame the Skins for not signing him…
…
when Derek Carr signed his deal this year he had MORE starts than Kirk had APPEARANCES in games
and you have to admit, Kirk has definitely progressed, but at the same time, there’s a lot of uncertainty (lets call it) in the film during the time when “he should have been signed long term”
I don’t think we can fault the Skins FO for that. Now, did this get personal? Did they think the bridges were burning when it was just business for Kirk? I dunno. Kirk has treated this differently than most players do, and he might have a blind spot in terms of what the perception is with team. On one hand nobody blames him for FA, but on the other, you want your team-mate. right?
I don’t blame the FO for not signing him after 2015, but they should have gotten a deal done last year when he proved he was legit. We’ll never know, but I bet he would have signed if we had put the deal we just gave Smith on the table.
That Giants game really made everyone pause I think.
Maybe. I don’t know.
I do. That’s exactly when they should have done it and SM wanted too. They did offer him 12 million dollars a year and he refused
they weren’t sure he was anything more than an adequate game manager and he thought he was an elite-leaning franchise QB in the making. maybe he will prove everyone wrong. but he isnt going to do that here. I just think it was a sane response by the front office. I don’t think it was poor management, neither obviously was there some special sauce magic that other orgs seem to have at times.
Kirk didn’r want to get a deal done last year Kirk wants to be a FA, he was not going to negotiate no matter the offer.
Kirk didn’t get the job done in 2016 or 2017. We missed the playoffs. Nice stats, but didn’t win when it mattered most. You don’t pay top dollar for that. Smart move by the FO. This experiment was a failure, time to move onto the next experiment.
I just think it was a bad situation.
The FO may have not made the best of it, but they ended up making it not a disaster it seems.
*I mean overall. Getting Smith without some dumb crazy deal was prob the best they could do for this offense.
Quite remarkable I must say
Don’t know how you expect any QB to win without his team being able to create or stop a running game.
Giants game, Dec 2016. Nuff said.
But I agree, we won’t win much without the run improvements.
Kirk put a *lot* on his shoulders to get the team into position where that game mattered. Also, if you ask any KC fan, they’ll tell you that Alex Smith has a reputation for not coming through in the games that matter as well 🙁
Throughout it all, he never once sounded like a Redskin. Him and his wanting to go where he’s wanted garbage.
And then there’s the way no one ever rushed over to help him up when he got knocked down.
Over his career Smith is…
2 – 2 vs ny
1 – 2 vs dallas
3 – 4 vs philthy
Get J Landry, a hoss of OG in FA or the draft, and a nice TE in the draft and he might have something here
so long as Thompson stays healthy
Vernon Davis and Thompson could have monster years
Or they could be IR by Game1
Off to the gym…
Kirk is gone guys… move on
Okay….so if don’t want Alex Smith, and Kirk Cousins was NOT going to sign here, who was YOUR alternative.
I already asked that below… except I was kind enough to post the entire list of free agent QB’s
I thought you worked here?
I’d roll with Colt and keep the QB payroll cheap until we had both lines sorted.
God doggitt , you didn’t say that . Take that back.
I said it. If I’m Bruce Allen, what I’m telling Jay is:
“I’m gonna keep getting you linemen until you show me you can run the ball and stop the run. Once you can do those things, I’ll go find you a QB.”
there’s nothing stopping them from grabbing a high level OG and DL or LB in this draft
Could have grabbed a QB in the draft as well. The thing is, if you go with either a rookie QB or you let Colt play, you aren’t spending $20mm+ a year on a quarterback when the rest of the team isn’t ready to win.
how is this team not ready to win?
we remember the team that limped home
we forget the team that embarrassed the Raiders, beat the Rams on the road, took the Chiefs to the limit @ Arrowhead, and still knuckled up to beat Seattle on the road
I would have stuck with the guy that knows the playbook. Drafted a rookie, given him a clipboard and told him to pay attention. And, turned all that saved cap loot into building the roster up.
No matter what Buck says….that would have been the smartest move they could make. Damn goof that they didn’t.
Ha! I wonder if KC’s new team will give him his own personal little desk.
Shana-way will give him a corner office.
https://secure.img1-fg.wfcdn.com/im/94455364/resize-h300-w300%5Ecompr-r85/4083/40839621/monarch-hill-poppy-4162-writing-desk.jpg
Smith
88-62-1
Alex Smith is not a MAJOR upgrade from Kirk, but the eye test says he’s a gamer.
He basically IS an older Kirk Cousins… and cheaper
Thats what i think
Yes . The shame of it being one guy was a 4th rd pick and already on the team. That’s a failure .
Actually he wasn’t on the team
Comparable strengths and negatives.
Except Kirk turns the ball over more.
Lateral move at best; probable slight downgrade. However, I believe the cost differential is significant.
Also, being able to get out of the contract in two years will be a big deal.
but the true measure playoff wins Does not. We’ve traded one mediocre quarterback for another mediocre quarterback who’s older and cheaper. End of story and giving away a draft pick
Turnovers… look at the turnover ratio. Kirk blew big games with INTs and Fumbles. Alex Smith gives us a chance in close games.
And a high-end young slot CB
So, KC’s not staying. Who would you have signed?
2nd half of this years AFC wild card game, not a gamer .
The Redskins might just franchise Breeland.
AHAHAHAHAHAAAAA!!!!
LOL!!!!!!
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAH!!!!!
Dude
How’s your blood sugar?
Breeland would blow out a knee moving so fast to sign the deal
The Redskins have a VERY good, young DB coach in Torian Gray, we have 7 draft picks and some cash.
And a few more Tech kids coming out
The Redskins have historically drafted a very high number of DBs, and they’ll no doubt continue to do so. They’ll find a new CB one way or the other.
My historical draft trends analysis from earlier this year: http://www.thehogsty.com/2017/04/18/lets-talk-redskins-draft-tendencies/
we have also done a good job of developing DBs the last few years
the kid from Va Tech that got hurt, Breeland, Fuller, Dunbar
Jarret
🙂
Also Dunbar
You didn’t mention Dunbar
…but look at it this way.
1. No more Kirk drama
2. No more contract talk; Smith is here for at least 3 years.
3. Smith is the unchallenged starter
4. We don’t have to burn a 1st round pick on a QB
5. We can TRULY use our 1st round pick to meet a need which is everywhere except QB.
Shhhh….mind the jinx man.
Until Cousins is signed and gone….shhhhhhh.
Also, he’ll be challenged. Book it. He’s playing from behind. By a lot.
I absolutely LOVE reading Redskins fans reactions to things.
I hate losing Fuller, but let’s not overreact.
It’s not just losing the talent at the position, it’s the pants dropping of it all that really makes the deal stink of dog doo.
the pants would be off if they show up to free agency without a Quarterback.
I mean, you’re less likely to keep even your own defensive FAs
I have not been able to follow any of this all day long since early this morning. But I have a hard time getting excited for Alex Smith as our quarterback. He is older than Cousins and has not won a significant playoff game in spite of having a very strong rushing attack and defense, two things cousins never had. Not to mention we gave away a 3rd round pick and a 22 year old cornerback that was very very good. Good organizations don’t let young Talent go
Good organizations do what they need to do to get ahold of a quality starting QB. Kendall Fuller had a good year, but he’s replaceable. Smith was one of the top QBs on the market this year, maybe #1 depending on how you view Cousins. If the Redskins get 4 years of 2017-like performance out of Smith, this trade is a massive win.
Smith had a good year. But he’s replaceable.
That’s what I’m getting there from ya.
Who are you going to get to replace him? You do that & I’ll find the corner, and we’ll see who gets done the fastest.
by any measure, no one could argue that our front office has been competent and able to field a winning franchise.
If you recall last season…Jay publicly stating why he likes certain guys. Work ethic, knowledge of the playbook. Guys that earn their playing time. Then there’s his penchant for under dogs. Guys cast aside.
Well, there’s a QB on the team that’s been with Jay since 14′, and, can recite the playbook in his sleep….
….and that guy would do okay keeping the seat warm for a year or so, but he doesn’t have the arm to be a long-term NFL starter.
Don’t need a cannon to work Jay’s system.
And, have you seen Smith’s intermediates throws? If you haven’t yet, you will.
his stats are almost identical to cousins. He’s older than cousins. And for some of you to completely ignore the fact that he has had a very strong rushing attack and defense the whole time he’s been in Kansas City makes this argument moved. Cousins has had neither. And he played with a crazy offensive line this past season and scrubs for wide receivers and no tight end except for Vernon Davis he’s almost as old as I am
Alex Smith is 2-5 in the playoffs…he’s been 7 times and won twice, not very good, but he’s been. Kirk’s been once and hasn’t won shit.
7 times vs 1 . I’m trying here …..help me .
a football team cannot make it to the playoffs unless they have a good defense and offense and an offense needs to have a good rushing attack you have a good special teams unit that’s icing on the cake. Alex Smith had all of these things and still did not win the big games. He won’t do it for us either he’s older and cheaper and maybe has a fraction more Mobility
I know .
are you just completely ignoring the fact that the Chiefs and Alex Smith have had a very strong defense and rushing attack
The Redskins had a good enough defense to beat the Packers in 2015.
We had a pretty good defense this year until the grim reaper hit us in the knees
This I agree with, however, my statement still stands because of all the injuries. My point is Alex Smith had these tools And did not get it done what makes you think he’s going to get it done for us?
I don’t think he’s going to get it done with us… but I didn’t think Kirk was either.
Andy Reid is a chronic choker…
so we traded one mediocre quarterback for an older cheaper mediocre quarterback
…to work on adding other players and train up a young QB.
You got it.
The way Smith runs our offense will be the difference maker. He is less turnover prone. The production in the red zone should improve. That equals wins.
Well KC threw for a gazillion yards in the wind and several TD’s . That might of had an effect.
now you’re being absurd. On Any Given Sunday Any team can beat the other. Unless you’re the Browns.
So with this deal, since 2012 the Skins have invested 3 1st round picks, one 2nd round pick, one 3rd round pick, one 4th round pick, one 6th round pick, about 140 mil (counting only Smith’s guaranteed money) and Kendall Fuller, in the QB position…and we have Alex Smith now. Alright then
Sounds like we’re breathing down the Browns necks
photo finish on tap…
Except for the fact that they’re 1 – 31, sure.
Just in the QB realm. We’re also not in Cleveland or named the “Browns”
let’s just say when you look up the word competency in the dictionary, Our front office will not be next to that word.
BB press conference . hilarious .
the 3rd rounder kinda sucks. The only way this would make sense is if we drafted a young guy in the 2nd or 3rd. Plenty of time before draft but would love to get that back and nab Rudolph or someone and still add to the DL or stud RB…
Hard to draft a guy in the third…
hence why I said get it back..via trade down or whatever..
Ahhh… I tend to zone out if I have to read more than a sentence…
1st two rounds, IMO = DL, RB, in that order.
That’s where I’m at.
Can you imagine if Barkley was available at 13?
No.
-Cleveland
Maybe… but I wouldn’t be too sure.
I have a feeling that the contract is going to be lighter than expected on hard g’s, but the contract structure will make it kinda difficult to sit Smith, and with only 4 year rookie deals, you;d be in same spot you are now with Cousins
Alex Smith is not a fan of creed 2 points
Big fan or Mormon Tabernacle Choir; -2 points. Net 0.
Buck started that rumor
he is a Mormon .
Come on… who’s not a fan of the Mormon Tabernacle Choir for fucks sake?
OK, just -1. Mormons scare me a little.
My first wife was a Mormon… super freak.
My neighbors are Mormons and they are bat shit crazy . I’ve told this before .
Remember I told ya’ll the dude said every girl’s first sexual experience should be with her father ? He had two daughters by the way . Sick son of a bitch . My dad hated him and he was an easy going man .
I don’t think that represents most Mormons by the way . At least I hope not .
Was banging an Assembly of God gal for a bit. She invited me to her church….first time I ever saw people speaking in tongues. Weird shit.
Thanks Steve for article. As Scamp said, great argument starter.
Im in the minority but didn’t think Hatcher was a total bust…
Hatcher was a shit ball
I see people looking at the INT/TD ratio of Smith and Cousins, however lets not forget sack/fumbles.
Since 2015, Alex Smith has been sacked 108 times, and fumbled 13 times (7 of those were recovered by the Chiefs).
Since 2015, Kirk Cousins has been sacked 90 times, and fumbled 31 times (14 of those were recovered by the Skins).
Think about that one…
Yikes
That is an interesting stat. Kirk does fumble a shitload
Lead the league last season
Butter fingered bastard.
good pull…
Wow, great pull. So KC turned the ball over 17 times on sacks? That’s fuggin cray-cray.
I think part of it is that KC just refuses to throw the ball away.
That’s not good , no arguing that .
I think we’re a better team in the short term with Alex Smith then we likely would have been with Colt or a rookie. Not sure it was a smart move in the long term though
I hope folks liked this column, because it was a huge amount of work.
Speak up if you have something you’d like to see us do.
It was a great column. This is the type of stuff that settles… or starts… arguments. Well done.
I concur . Thanks for putting in the time .
I bust your chops, Steve, but great work! Really appreciate the effort you and your other cohorts are putting into this site.
It’s two weeks worth of write ups that we used to get at that other place.
Free Agent Quarterbacks
Jimmy Garoppolo (26)
Kirk Cousins (29)
Drew Brees (39)
Teddy Bridgewater (25)
Case Keenum (30)
Sam Bradford (30)
Josh McCown (39)
Jay Cutler (34)
Blaine Gabbert (28)
Matt Moore (33)
Ryan Fitzpatrick (35)
Geno Smith (27)
Tom Savage (27)
Drew Stanton (34)
Austin Davis (28)
Matt Barkley (27)
Brock Osweiler (27)
Derek Anderson (34)
Chad Henne (32)
Chase Daniel (31)
T.J. Yates (30)
E.J. Manuel (28)
Tyler Bray (26)
Joe Webb (31)
Mark Sanchez (31)
Brandon Weeden (34)
Kellen Clemens (34)
Josh Johnson (31)
Ryan Mallett (29)
Scott Tolzien (30)
*cough*
-Robert Griffin III
Not *cough*; rather, *throwup*
Granted, he’s no Tyler Bray….
I think the list makes it pretty clear why Alex Smith was such a hot commodity
sarcasm???
Did you read the list?
Is there anyone on that list that wasn’t going to be resigned that you would want more?
I would have preferred any of the MN QBs with no draft/player compensation.
Bridgewater… not Bradford. Keenum ain’t going anywhere
Nothing wrong with Bradford if he can stay healthy, and apparently his knee is good to go.
No.
No, no, no
[clears throat]
-Colin Kaepernick
No thanks
I would have sworn Steve would have been all for signing Kapernick. LOL
I know, that threw me for a loop!
Guys that were actually on teams this past season
Kaepernick turned out to not be a better QB than Smith.
But maybe gotten him cheaper?
Definitely could have gotten him cheaper, but I think not a great fit for Jay’s offense.
thanks for list. As probably stated earlier, we aren’t winning anything the next 2-3 years, IMO. Alex Smith IS NOT the missing piece. I would’ve went on the cheap in QB FA, drafted a guy in the 2nd (or 3rd) and continue to build OL/DL and rest of defense. This is a serious investment into a 34yr old guy. It just doesn’t make sense from a QB perspective….
Think about if we went cheap on QB and went 3-13… fans would have revolted… again
In a year or 2 his salary will be middle of the pack and we’ll be ready to start a rookie
prob 2020 draft, then you get 1 year to sit, and 1 year with Smith riding shotgun
I’d bet next year…
Here you go Steve… who are the prospective QB’s in the draft next season?
the problem with next year is that his QB cap is going to be too high to start a kid the next year
maybe. we ll have to see what the real g’s are in the contract. shoot, by year 3 it might be just injury g’s
Forever rebuild!
We’ve been rebuilding for 10 years or so. Every year, people are like we’re still rebuilding.
Bullshit. Look at Philly. You do your best to field a winner as soon as you can. A lot can change in three years of a “rebuild” process.
No, the problem is that we have been avoiding rebuilding, and as a result always wind up patching together mediocre teams.
it is a constant process in a FA world. do well, and you’re going to lose good FAs. do poorly, and you’re going to lose good FAs. it is a forever rebuild, but as to the season by season outputs
I think people forget this team is better than the 2016 team by a couple of games if not for the injuries. that happens. it happened to the Giants too.
call it rebuild or call it going for the gusto, either way, Alex Smith aint it. He’s mediocre AT BEST. Always has been. And playing the averages, he’s on the wrong side of 30 for that position.
Funny Korean Army story
guy from our church went to Vietnam, was assigned as adviser to Korean Special Forces unit
said every time the shooting started a bunch of the Korean would jump on top of him
asked the Korean major what was going on
Major said “Told troops if you get hurt we lose face, I’ll shoot them. So you no get hurt”
Remember, before Alex Smith started playing with KHunt, he had Jamaal Charles in KC and Gore in SF.
How many playoff games has he won ?
Two more than KC.
One out of five in Kansas City .
Have you seen his playoff stats
Compare those to KC’s win and in games against the Giants
Ok which is it ? Stats or wins ? Like I said , one out of five in Kansas City . He has been a starter a lot longer than Cousins , so he has naturally had more chances .
I have no problem with Smith. Not sure what you’re trying to accomplish with this. As far as I’m concerned there was no real chance of the Skins signing Cousins this year.
Doesn’t make the trade smart.
Not trying to accomplish anything . Just discussing what he has done or hasn’t done .
He probably hasn’t been baptized…..Kirk 1, Smiff 0
Alec is a Mormon . What else you got to say ?
He believes in solar babies
Was awesome on Jeopardy.
He’s more likely to have 3 wives than Kirk
If he’s extra good, someday he and his wife will get their own planet, where they can procreate for eternity, making the solar babies I mentioned above.
Sorry, I was responding to btg.
Hell , IDK what I was trying to say . Playing Devil’s advocate which is pointless . Kurt gone . Alec is here.
My point is that he has always had a solid run game to work with as well.
Also, may offset part of the fact that he’s thrown less TD’s (and less yards) than Cousins. My guess is that if you looked back you’d likely see that his teams had ore yards and TD’s running than the Skins. I.e., a more balanced attack.
It’d be wise for the Skins to get a real running back rather than the mediocrity they’ve been rolling with the past several years.
and I agree , while Cousins never has . Not once .
most common Korean surnames (alternate spellings)
1. Kim
2. Lee (Yi, Rhee, Li)
3. Park (Pak)
The funny thing about the Lee surname is that when you spell it in Korean (Hangul), it’s just pronounced “Ee”. The ‘R’ and the ‘L’ sounds are the same sound and same Hangul character, and is pronounced as kind of a blend of the R/L sounds we use in English.
Lee family is my distant cousins
but they were from Northern Virginia
had a nice home overlooking DC
Who knew the Koreans were fighting in our Civil War!
Ree?
all they way back to the War for Independence
tough little bastards
Jason Reid was a donut swilling mad man before Mike Jones ever made the blog. Get your story straight
noonefromtampa • 2 hours ago
forgot to comment before
but for the record, I’m fairly certain I started the donut thing and it was with Mike Jones because of his crappy photo they used at the top of TI looked like he had been cramming donuts
and that’s why he was late posting every story cause he was out looking for more donuts and all the peeps really ran it with
Keith even came on and said to stop it, that Mike was really a good guy, give him a chance
Yeah, I’m dry-snitchin’
Prefer wet-snatchin’.
Obviously
Reid was about whatever free foods the Redskins were feeding the media pool
Mike Jones is who we really made fun of for the donut thing
Not true… you are incorrect in you disrememberment. I started the donut thing with Jay Reid… some of you lackies misappropriated it.
… it all started because he was a fat ass and so I called him a donut swilling jackass. Called him that for a while… you misappropriated it
So like Noone not to go through the proper appropriation process.
I guess it’s possible the 2 of us used roughly the same analogy at two different times about something that was relatively common knowledge about beat reporters.
Reid even told the story about eating a donut guarding the door while Jasno was BHGO in the bathroom because the Redskins while figured out what social media was and what the reporters were doing
AH HA!!!
Good writeup, Steve. Your due diligence is legendary.
I give the blame and the credit for all three phases to Bruce Allen.
Trey Gowdy stepping down to focus on his new barber shop business:
https://scontent-dft4-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/27067632_10156236245071800_6075939794725763176_n.jpg?oh=6557e5f347bb8b5e1741376767970eb8&oe=5B1CE3E1
Great, now who’s going to run the Benghazi investigation?!
Who is Trey Gowdy?
GOP rep. from SC, most famous for endlessly investigating Benghazi.
Interesting comparison.
https://twitter.com/MoveTheSticks/status/958811478949335040
Do the same thing just KC and Smith
Smith has thrown for 11,030 yards, 61 TDs, 20 picks, completed about 66.5% of his passes in the same time frame
https://twitter.com/TSteegeNFL/status/958531889597333505
They didn’t have a current QB
Yep, although Kirk wasn’t really our current QB since he wasn’t under contract and had no plans of signing with the Skins. The Skins screwed it up in 2015 and this was their desperation move to cover up their mistake
Cousins: 13,176 yds, 81 TDs, 36 INTs
A Smith: 11,030 yds., 61 TDs, 20 INTs
Obviously the Chiefs had a better record than the Skins.
I’ll trade stats for more wins
Then you’ll need a good running game and defense like Alex Smith had
And signing KC would have prevented that from happening
They aren’t paying that much less for Smith then they paid Kirk this year, and they could have had Kirk a lot cheaper if they had any foresight after the 2015 season. Also, you don’t just go out and buy a run game and defense
Me too, but wins is a team stat — not an individual player stat.
OK but that’s a team thing . Redskins once again gave up more yardage vs the run than any other team . Points allowed ….all that shit
If you just talk about this past season , I would argue Smith had much better weapons .
…and a run game. Which means he throws for less yards and TD’s.
He also has a fair number of rushing yds, unlike KC, although Cousins had more rushing TDs this year.
With Alex’s RB’s… it goes to reason he would have less rushing TD’s
I know it’s mostly political theatre and no matter what you’re politics are , you have to be in awe of that N Korean guy . That’s courage in its highest form .
Courage?
No…
Why would you say that ?
He’s attempting to take on the world and the most powerful nation in it while possibly getting the whole of his country wiped of the planet…
That’s stupid
We got to be talking about two different people or either I didn’t see the entire thing .
I’m just talking about Kim in general. I didn’t know you were referencing something specific
No , hell no. Talking about the defector that was tortured , and run over by a train , severing his limbs .
Ahhh… I thought you were talking about the mad man. When talking about Koreans it takes a bit more to identify than simply “Kim.” You’re speaking about 80% of the people
No. Now the guy is helping other N Koreans escape. The shit this guy went through was horrific .
Gotcha… yea.
Jason ReidVerified account
@JReidESPN
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Jason Reid Retweeted Master Tesfatsion
Master, they weren’t gonna have a QB. If you have a chance to get a solid guy like Smith, you don’t hold it up for a slot corner. Even a good one.
________________________
Whoa… Donut Mauler changes course
He was saying the same thing yesterday.
But I mean he changed course on forever bashing the Skins no matter what
OK. True on that point.
He hasn’t wavered on this. Like I said earlier, he’s been supportive of the trade since it happened.
Also, Mike Jones = Donut Mauler.
Um… I’m the one that created that whole scenario with the donuts… and it was given to Jason Reid. A couple, less perceptive, folks misappropriated it to mike Jones. Mike Jones was not fat… Jason Reid was.
Somebody else claimed that an hour ago.
They are wrong… it was I.
Lol, best name ever
Yeah, Jason Reid’s a pretty sweet name.
Oh, sorry. Were you referring to Master Tesfatsion’s name?
Vita Vea!
Donut Mauler, jackass
Donut Mauler
http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2018/01/browns_offered_chiefs_one_of_t.html
Basically the Browns offered at least a 2nd round pick, but were going to draft their Next in this draft and were not interested in signing Smith to a longer term deal.
Not nearly as rich as Fuller + a 3rd rounder.
they’re spinning as if the Browns offered more in trade value
Can’t say that when you don’t know who they could have gotten
Dude, come the fuck on. By your standard we can’t judge the wisdom of ANY action in real time.
How can you say that the player at the second round pick is more or less valuable when you don’t know who it’s going to be
BTG, the odds say its a better pick (and history will back that up over the long term).
Regardless, Fuller + 3rd Rounder is much better than second rounder.
NE trades Tom Brady to Cleveland for a 7th round pick. Can we say that’s a bad deal before we find out who the 7th rounder is, and see how he progresses over the next 3-4 years? I’m thinking we can.
So they offered a second for a short term solution?
As far as free agent success/failure goes, it seems to me the person who should be called out is Alex Santos, our Director of Pro Player Personnel. Per the Redskins’ bio: “He is responsible for coordinating the advance scouting of Redskins opponents and the evaluation of all professional leagues for potential free agents and trade prospects.”
Santos=Satan. Close enough.
-Pitchfork Fans
Is he even here legally? How do we know he’s not an MS-13 member?
-Miller
Slow day
Everyone burned out
RIP Former NBA player Rasual Butler died early Wednesday morning in a single-car crash in Los Angeles, the Los Angeles County coroner’s office confirmed. Butler was 38.
His wife was also killed. I didn’t know who she was but apparently she’s a recording artist who was on season 3 of American Idol.
Alright , I got my fit bit on. Gonna go see if I can give myself a heart attack . I need to find out how far I’ve been walking /jogging . I think its two miles . It sounded good to say that anyway . Bought a fit bit yesterday too see how bad I’ve been lying .
Later
Dearly beloved…
Haha
we have gathered here today
To get through this thing called life
Don’t ever buy your wife one and then jokingly call it a fatbit. Like ever.
No , never.
“Does this outfit make me look fat?”
“No dear, your fat makes you look fat.”
– Never say that
Hell no! She’s not fat, btw, and trying to remain that way, hence the “baby, buy me a Fitbit”. I thought it was funny, so did my daughter. My wife….not so much.
Where do you want to eat?
http://2.media.collegehumor.cvcdn.com/64/45/0016f1294bdb84e46e039681d77bc329-the-best-restaurant-to-go-to-if-you-dont-care.jpg
Never .
Does this make my butt look big?
No, your butt accomplishes that on it’s own
Don’t say that either
“Do you like my new haircut?”
“If I wanted to marry a dude I’d just gonna ahead and done that.”
Don’t say that either.
“What do you want to do tonight?”
“Someone else.”
Don’t say that, either.
Good job, Buck
Thanks. Hard as hell to get started , but not bad once you get going . Feel really good when you’re done .
FYI- 1.5 miles . Took 28 minutes .
2021 – breaking news Kirk Cousins is married to 3 women, that’s right his wife has two sister wives
“Hey, I got $44M from the Redskins why shouldn’t glorify these women. We might add another one if we can find a good match”
prob more likely than the whole white slavery thing
2021 turns out he’s been embezzling funds from a charity for disabled orphans, and secretly using the money to fund a guns for drugs scheme.
…AND…
These media people say anything . They have no idea . Saying all kinds of crazy shit about this move . They don’t understand that Cousins refused to sign a LTD . Trying to insist the Skins didn’t want him.
I think both are true.
I think the brass wasn’t in unison on the latter.
How do you know that they didn’t
It would have leaked. Or Bruce would have said something in a presser by now.
they didn’t want him at his price
and they didn’t want to give him that price as early as he thought they should
even then, there’s no g that he wouldn’t have selected this FA path anyway if it was his goal from the start
Folks do realize that KC could have overruled his agent and instructed him to get a deal done here right?
Making his agent out to be the driving force doesn’t fly with me
Sure, if his agent was the problem he could have got rid of him.
Yup. Agent advises and works for the client.
I would hope most folks had understood that from the beginning.
Seriously
Not even close
I mean, what about Kirk Cousins ever inspired anyone to think he wouldn’t make his own, well advised decisions?
Jock-shock
that is when the police really don’t like you and taser your nuts
Or as they call that in Baltimore, “when they let you off with a warning”
Alex Smith, not on twitter?
Like him already.
X1000
@JPFinlayNBCS
7m7 minutes ago
Just talked with Kirk Cousins and wished him luck. He seems in good spirits. Not doing interviews
——
Just realized Kirk is gonna have to make up a whole new document on press people with their pictures.
Jim Rome just had a quick cut during the break that noted he was interviewed on his show yesterday, and he didn’t show it if he had any knowledge of it
He probably didn’t… The team and him iced each other.
Good freakin dude . Great character and work ethic . I wish him nothing but the best personally .
Yep. There shouldn’t be any animosity from the fans toward Cousins, really. Even though there will be.
That goes without saying . Fan base is loaded with dipshits
I like the guy, but I’m still gonna poke fun at him.
Nothing wrong with that .
*smash cut*
He’s got a harem full of white slaves (et al) in Yemen on the D-L
Santana Moss on CDVtW
“We knew that Kirk was not coming back”
“We got the next best thing to Kirk”
Cowherd is reporting KC and Denver are close to a deal. I don’t see how that is until March .
the only way that can happen is if the Skins gave them permission to talk
And there’s something in it for the Skins. Otherwise, why would they let them talk?
correct
at this point, they could prob just swap picks and it’d be enough
Teams talk to players early all the time. Legal or not.
Yeah, but that doesn’t get broadcasted, because, you know, the rules.
Fact is Denver probably started talking to Kirk some time mid season via an intermediary.
how much would it be worth to Denver to ostensibly get this done before free agency
that would be the only question, I think
and the Redskins are g’d nothing in terms of comp picks, so…
Sweet! Tag-n-trade time, lol.
Will never, ever, happen
Of course not. Damn sarcasm font on this site sucks.
never ever,
ever ever?
Ever ever?
Never.
Cowherd knows nothing and he hasn’t a clue
Yeah, since when is cowherd anything more than a shock-jock.
He’s not even a shock – jock. He’s a sports radio guy.
Shock Jockery requires an ability to be funny and smart.
He does neither.
Also an ability to get women to come on to your radio station and take their cloths off.
O-tay. How bout jock-shock?
That sounds like a bad case of jock itch, which is close to what Cowherd is. So maybe that’s accurate.
So just like a teenage girl Swearinger deleted her tweets
Stay
Off
Twitter
He was overreacting . Bad .
If you are emotionally unstable
Stay
Off
Twitter
until you’ve reached Acceptance, stay off twitter?
Also If you are emotionally unstable
Stay
Off
Thehogsty.com
actually this place would be a ghost town.
True, and that includes the anal retentive bunch over there.
anal ? I love it there .
Squinns
Shots fired! WOOT!
Yep, your wife’s tongue can get really deep in there. Kinda a colon cleaning.
LOL .
Don’t forget that you kiss that tongue!
I don’t imagine I’ll get 1 ounce of sympathy. But I have a 7 and 9 year old at home who are going to be really, really disappointed to hear their favorite player is a goner for sure.
I’ve been prepping them since last year, but this is the first big FA loss of their young fandom.
Maybe Flounder could stop by and give them a pep talk? 🙂
“Kirk now likes to be called Alex”
Same here… my son wanted a Cousins jersey for Christmas and that stupid fat man in a red suit got him one.
I am the stupid fat man in a red suit
We all play that role at some point.
My son wanted one too. I told him maybe next year. Lol. Now they’ll be cheaper than RG jerseys.
Take the jersey and wash it with a bunch of bleach till it’s a broncos orange color
https://twitter.com/JPFinlayNBCS/status/958787342365577216
Easiest photoshop job ever, changing a guy from KC to DC.
He’s red and yellow, though.
SF was more Red and Gold. But yes.
Poor Pryor……….. 🙂
Looks like someone is going to need some re-brand work soon.
https://kirkcousins.org/
Glad I didn’t buy a T-shirt from him.
looks like someone is going to have a sitewide blowout Clearance Sale soon
I could be wrong , but I was under the impression SM was operating under a strained budget due to that cap hit we took prior to him getting the job. I was under the impression he had to get some bottom dollar talent level people to fill in some holes .
They’ll skip right over this…..
well if that’s correct it should be noted if we are judging his performance .
Care for a donut?
Nope . I do not any donuts . Last thing I need .
I here ya. Not a literal donut, btw
I know .
Scot was on record of not embracing FA’s, but understood the need to fill out a roster. I recall quotes to the effect of ‘ they’re free agents for a reason’ and ‘I don’t like to sign other teams former problems’.
sounds like something he would say
So DJ deleted his ranting tweet(s).
smart
You’d think his agent called him.
If you are DJ’s agent do you have some notification on your phone any time DJ tweets?
Here 1 ding. Eh things are fine.
Suddenly hear 9 dings real quick. You are calling him before you finish reading what he wrote.
Yes
https://twitter.com/twitter/statuses/957994763357184000
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On @Browns_Daily right now @AllbrightNFL said that “Alex Smith chose Washington due to the long term deal that the Skins were offering.” Added Browns offered multiple picks but wanted him for short term deal and Denver offered a 2nd and Aqib Talib!
Posted that last thread.
I was out to lunch didn’t read back far enough. My apologies.
Alec Smiff’d?
Well my moms maiden name was Smith
If my dad had been less responsible who knows, I could have been Alex Smith.
So we’re good!
Thanks, didn’t see it last thread
forgot to comment before
but for the record, I’m fairly certain I started the donut thing and it was with Mike Jones because of his crappy photo they used at the top of TI looked like he had been cramming donuts
and that’s why he was late posting every story cause he was out looking for more donuts and all the peeps really ran it with
Keith even came on and said to stop it, that Mike was really a good guy, give him a chance
always with a glass of maple syrup
Would you like a donut?
Yes but the Doughnuts thing also had been going with Jason Reid years before.
yes but we really hammered Mike Jones with that
Jones was the only guy over there who would never respond when I tried to get him to come on the show.
Dude is too big for his britches (both literally and figuratively).
He’s not a big guy. He’s tiny
for free agency I would rate the FO people in this order
1. Allen
2. Shanny
3, McGlue
4. Vinny the Rat
I couldn’t stomach including Vinny in this exercise.
for drafting
1. Allen
2. McGlue
3. Shanny
4. Vinny the Rat
McCloughan had the lowest hit rate and the highest miss rate in my draft analysis: http://www.thehogsty.com/2018/01/10/bruce-allen-just-might-be-a-better-drafter-than-scot-mccloughan/
facts are better than impressions every time
Goodell giving State of NFL speech
We are building a wall between the Patriots and everyone else.
Front office still anti DACA
Defense
Also
Can
Attack
promote the Pats to the Premier league
and start another expansion team
I have seen that suggested once before, that the way the NFL expands is by adding 12 more teams or whatever the number would be as a Div 2, and have relegation every season. (top 3 teams in Div 2 vs bottom 3 in Div 1)
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Goodell says recently spent 3 hrs and went thru 150 plays with others at league office looking at catch rule. Trying to clean up catch rule
They need to set it back to what it used to be.
I would change it to
1. one foot in bounds
2. must control to the ground or
3. must make one stride after catch (football movement)
I disagree with 1 foot in bounds. I like the 2 foot rule more than the college rule.
Not to over complicate it, but how about 1 foot with defensive contact and 2 without?
OMG YOU EXPECT A REF TO BE ABLE TO COUNT TO 2!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
They can use their testies to keep count.
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Cards expected to release Adrian Peterson
After writing the draft analysis and now the free agency analysis, with perhaps a look at key undrafted free agents to come, what’s really jump off the page (or pages….and pages) is that, despite his reputation and the fact that he very clearly had a solid team building strategy, unlike Bruce Allen (although Mike Shanahan did), the results that Scot M. achieved were no better, and in some ways worse, than the other two.
In other words, I think Redskins fans are romanticizing Scot’s time in DC a bit out of their frustration for the non-stop mediocrity.
Yup, would have to agree. BUT, would have loved to see Scot get five years. O well.
Show me where Scot was truly “the final say” and I’ll accept that. There is one common denominator across the entire timeline, and it’s not Dan Snyder.
well, Dan Snyder IS a common denominator
But not the applicable denominator.
Hey, does anyone know when Tanard is eligible for reinstatement?
Yes, never
He is eligible to apply for the ability to be reinstated
I was joking
me too
I think he is doing Uber-High weed deliveries around MD
companion service to Uber-Eats
One thing about Scot’s FA’s were none were dead money issues once they were released. He was filling holes with more-or-less stop gaps, less Norman, to hopefully field a decent team until he had time to build through the draft. Of course, that opportunity didn’t happen either.
Stephen Paea was a dead money hit, as was Culliver.
Not much though. And Culliver was injured, but point taken.
My thought on Culliver when writing this was that it doesn’t matter why it didn’t work, only that it didn’t, because either way, he got a big contract and then didn’t play.
yes cause should not matter, poor play or injury
he did not work out well for us
we’ve had the Culliver discussion, was playing well after his 1 game suspension then shredded his knee and ended his career
If he’s talking big crippling hits, he’s right,
They were still 7 figure dead money hits. Those two guys were at the top of my dead money list.
And didn’t Culliver have a void in his contract that he could be cut without any further guarantees if he had any legal troubles (which he did)?
His legal troubles voided his guarantee, but the team still had a big dead cap hit.
yes they had a void for his g’money if he got suspended for his pending legal issue which he did
smart move by Eric and BA
I’m sorry, that sounded like Moe. Teams was better, also.
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Talked w Ryan Leaf – he said moving from Kirk Cousins to Alex Smith is lateral at best and likely a downgrade for Redskins.
Ryan Leaf…..LOLOLOLOL
LOL. JP just made visiting hours I guess.
Leaf has actually turned his life around. He’s working in some sort of addiction recovery-type program now, to his credit.
Good to hear.
he’s an interesting listen
Yes I’ve heard him a few times in interviews, dude’s lived a hard life and is trying to be better for it.
He also does CBS Sports radio NFL analysis, I think.
“addition recovery” program.
Sounds like DC could benefit from this….
can’t play without a contract
Good analysis. IMO, I don’t think allowing Orakpo to walk was a mistake considering his injury history and contract he signed with the Titans.
I hear you. It was a tough call, but I labeled it as a mistake because he ended up being a quality performer, basically hitting the same numbers he hit for us – that we’ve been missing from the defensive right side since then.
Yeah, that’s fair too. I’m surprised – and happy for rak – that he’s stayed healthy.
Nicely put together, Mr. Steve.
To me, Culliver was an injury thing. If you extend Bruce and Jay a handicap for injuries, Scot gets one on Chris.
Rak, Rak couldn’t stay on the field. Rak couldn’t get a holding call. Rak wasn’t worth what Tennessee paid him, to us.
yeah, you’d like to keep Rak, but the money got too big
Culliver was definitely an injury thing, but either way, it didn’t work out.
Would rather get a side by side comparison of fuller and Moreau
Maybe, we’ll see. I’ve been working on this for awhile, and the trade happened last night.
Steve I think you should have used 5 categories home runs, hits, misses, busts, bad releases
that would have made for a nice summary table across the various GMs
example like
——— HR — Hits —- Misses —- Busts — BR
Allen —- 3 —– 4 ———- 2 ———- 2 —— 1
I thought about that, but this was already very long. That’s why I didn’t do a summary chart. Maybe I’ll add it.
First to say Go Alex Smith!